Liberty and Accessibility

Wednesday, June 20, 2007

[FL4RonPaul] Great Piece on the Iowa Situation (fwd)

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Subject: [FL4RonPaul] Great Piece on the Iowa Situation



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Iowa Presidential Debate Organizers Snub Ron Paul

Written by HYPERLINK ""Mike
Published June 20, 2007
?" \n
See also:
» HYPERLINK ""Ron Paul
and the Politics of Responsibility
» HYPERLINK ""Heads Up!
Is that a Piece of Concrete Falling from the Sky?
» HYPERLINK ""Peace Is
The Only Option for Israel

Few examples of the behind-the-scenes power exerting its authority over the
people are more impactful than the deliberate stranglehold on the free
speech of candidates running for office. Today, Ron Paul finds himself in
the chokehold of a couple of Iowa organizations that have refused to allow
his message to be heard on the same stage as other Republican candidates.
Ironically, one of the groups claims to be Christian.

As a former campaign manager for a popular candidate running for the
California State Assembly in a wealthy district of San Diego County a few
years back, I witnessed first-hand the backroom dirty dealing that goes on
in the political parties. In my particular experience, the candidate was the
front-runner but was eschewed by the Republican Party (the district was
historically Republican and so was my candidate) simply and solely on the
basis of the fact that he was black.

After weeks of phone calls, meetings and quiet inferences that the
Republican Party of San Diego County would support him if he bowed out of
the district for which he was running and moved to a southern district near
the Mexico border and ran for Congress against a Democrat who was firmly
planted there, my candidate accepted the fact that he would not be endorsed
by the county Republican Party (although he held office within that same
group). It was a conditional offer made by the party to provide support as a
sacrifical lamb in a congressional battle if he gracefully exited the race
in his home district. He declined. Not once, but several times.

Eventually, a high-ranking member of the Republican National Committee flew
down to see us. The "us" was just my candidate and myself. The three of us
were in an office conference room in Northern San Diego County when the
proposition was made plain. My candidate declined the "offer." In the
following weeks the field of candidates for the primaries in our district
tripled. When it came time to vote, there were 12 candidates flooding the
field in the Republican primary, including a couple of very wealthy
latecomers. In the end, we finished 4th.

I left politics after that.

It was quite apparent to me during my short involvement in the
behind-the-scenes organization of campaigns for issues and candidates that
what the public sees is often contrived, manipulated and sometimes
cutthroat. I remember when another well respected Republican candidate,
Ambassador Alan Keyes, was HYPERLINK
rested&total=3&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=0"taken away from a
debate (to which he was initially invited) in handcuffs because he refused
to acquiesce to the power that informed him he could not participate.

Today, the organizers in Iowa are preparing for a debate between Republican
presidential candidates. This time the odd man out is Ron Paul of Texas. His
campaign is quite dismayed at the display of hostile suppression by the
folks in Iowa who purport to be Iowans for Tax Relief and the Iowa Christian
Alliance. Such strongarm tactics to prevent Paul from addressing issues the
other candidates prefer to ignore is not in keeping with the spirit of our
constitutional rights to freedom of speech and the democratic process of
electing leaders.

The gatekeepers that guard access to the public will do no great service to
that public by dismissing a relevant voice in the presidential debate in
order to kowtow to the candidates that have ganged up against Paul. While
there is no outward proof that the other candidates intend to bow out or
have exercised some other clout necessary to close the gate on Paul, the
result is clear. Paul has not been invited to a debate his HYPERLINK
""campaign clearly desires to attend.

There is really no mystery here. Since the debate where Paul and Rudy
Guiliani briefly broached the topic of 9/11, Paul has been cast in the
shadows while the rest of the field has steered clear of the issue of 9/11
and Paul's specific comments. Nevertheless, the American people are
interested in the subject even as the national media joins in the effort to
suppress the issue from reaching mass audiences during primetime debate

Unfortunately, much of the American people are quite ignorant, intolerant
and impatient, as many in political circles rightly describe the general
population. Even a cursory look into the campaigns of numerous candidates
reveal methodologies designed to persuade the dumbest among us. Marketing
efforts seek to utilize jokes, references to pop culture and an overall
appeal to the "Sopranos" fans of America. That isn't to say everyone
watching the Sopranos has the IQ equal to their shoe size. But the overall
process of politicking and campaigning employs methods that insult the
intelligence of many as candidates clamor to pander to the popular culture
of the day.

Analyze the totality of the methods of marketing to the masses and you will
learn little about the candidates regarding the most important issues facing
this nation. They all just want to be liked, or receive the ultimate
compliment of being perceived as "cool."

The media is complicit in providing preferred candidates with a pass,
choosing to focus on issues that segue into great sound bites by the
candidates, rather than do the job of journalists and dig deep to expose the
true positions of those seeking to lead this nation.

How is it possible that the future Commander-in-Chief is not grilled
relentlessly (as are those appointed by him subject to the approval of
Congress) about his or her position on Iraq today, yesterday and as far back
as they were holding office? This nation has been at war in Iraq since 1991.
The rationale for sending more ground troops in 2003 was the case made by a
Commander-in-Chief with the approval of Congress in the aftermath of 9/11.
How is it possible that the media is not centered like a laser on the issue
of 9/11 and grilling each candidate about his or her evolving positions
regarding 9/11 and Iraq? Why is there no focus on the controversies
surrounding this administration's reaction to 9/11 and the conspicuously
missing Congress members who failed to call for an independent investigation
of a scene of mass murder?

There is no greater issue facing this nation than our involvement in the
"war on terror" that came as a result of 9/11.

Ron Paul has the courage and integrity to address the issue. He is today
alienated by much of the media and his colleagues running concurrent
campaigns for the same office. It is no secret that other candidates are
unwilling to appear on the same stage as Paul. After all, they are the lying
leaders who desire not to have their lies exposed through a thorough
scrutiny or debate. No such risk exists in dealing directly with a compliant
and complicit media. And no such risk exists when standing on a stage with
other puppets.

But Paul is no puppet. And the refusal to invite him to present his point of
view to the people of Iowa displays a haughty disrespect for Iowans in
general, and those supporters of Paul specifically.

Still, such dictatorial tactics are not the exception in American politics.
They are the rule. American politics is filled with propaganda, lies and
deception to the degree that the argument that claims every vote counts
stands on shaky ground.

Paul's plight is but one tiny example among many that point to a radically
changed nation that bears little resemblance to the one designed by the
framers of the constitution — whose deliberate restrictions upon an
otherwise tyrannical government have been thwarted by the very people to
whom they trusted all power. That's you and me, and the rest of the American

Mike Green is a Christian conservative, 12-year military veteran. He is a
former talk radio host, public speaker, award-winning columnist and the
Content Editor for a daily newspaper in Southern Oregon. Mike is also the
author of two books: The WHOLE Truth About the U.S. War on Terror: Answers
to Every Question You Never Knew to Ask and The Perfect Method for Finding
the Perfect Man.
Keep reading for information and comments on this article, and add some
feedback of your own!
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\nThe WHOLE Truth About the U.S. War on Terror HYPERLINK
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WHOLE Truth About the U.S. War on Terror
Mike Green
Book, Usually ships in 24 hours

Iowa Presidential Debate Organizers Snub Ron Paul

Published: June 20, 2007

Type: HYPERLINK ""Opinion

Section: HYPERLINK ""Politics

Writer: Mike Green

HYPERLINK ""Mike Green's BC Writer

HYPERLINK ""Mike Green's
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#1 — June 20, 2007 @ 11:26AM — Dave Nalle [HYPERLINK

Interesting article were it not for the fact that a large portion of it is a
pile of crap.

First off, your rambling accusations against the 'compliant and complicit'
media make no sense at all in this context, because while Paul was excluded
from this debate held by non-media groups, he's been invited to the much
more important August 5th debate in Iowa which is sponsored by the news
media, so it's not the news media who are at fault here, but these two
particular groups.

Second, every time Paul opens his mouth about 9/11 those who are potentially
sympathetic cringe, because they're afraid he's going to pander to the
lunatic fringe again as he has done in the past. It's not a strength for
him, it's a weakness. Most people are not delusional conspiracy nuts, and
when Paul starts talking to that crowd he alienates more mainstream voters.
Confronting the other candidates on the war is a strong move for Paul,
courting those who deny the facts about 9/11 is not. BTW, you try very hard
in this article to downplay your own belief in 9/11 conspiracy fantasy - why
do you take that tact? Could it be that you ALSO know that no one will take
you seriously if you start babbling about 9/11 conspiracies?

Third, there WAS an investigation of 9/11. Ever hear of the 9/11 Commission?
It was sponsored by congress but it was run by independent investigators and
it did a pretty damned thorough job with the hundreds of pages of report to
prove it. Congress doesn't push for an independent investigation because
they already HAD one and they're not going to second-quess the report they
sponsored. Oh, and the other reason is that all the things you want
investigated are transparently bogus.

Fourth, let me ask you a question about the candidate you worked for.
Something there doesn't ring true. You suggest that he didn't get support
because he was black, but in my experience, when given the choice the GOP
bends over backwards to look for and support black candidates. Is it
possible that he was challenging an incumbent? Incumbency is the one thing
that tends to make a candidate inviolate. Or did he share some of your
extremist views? That also tends to make the party blue hairs rather

Having said all of that, I agree that it's bizarre that Paul wasn't invited
to this debate. Considering that the groups sponsoring it are a Christian
group and a anti-tax group, how could they not like Paul? He's a Christian
extremist and the most anti-tax candidate around. He ought to be their dream


#2 — June 20, 2007 @ 11:32AM — FJ Hurst [HYPERLINK

Is that brushfire I smell in the wind? LONG LIVE RON PAUL!!!!!!!

"It does not take a majority to prevail ... but rather an irate, tireless
minority, keen on setting brushfires of freedom in the minds of men."
-- Samuel Adams

#3 — June 20, 2007 @ 11:35AM — Rudy G [HYPERLINK

"...they hate us for our FREEDOMS."

#4 — June 20, 2007 @ 11:40AM — bret [HYPERLINK

Dave - RP has never said it was a conspiracy, stop repeating this drivel.

#5 — June 20, 2007 @ 11:52AM — Dave Nalle [HYPERLINK

Bret, I didn't say that Paul believes in the 9/11 conspiracy, but that the
author of this article does. As I said, Paul panders to those people. He
skirts the subject, raises questions and keeps playing to the audience of
conspiracy nuts because he's found that they're willing to become fanatics
for any candidate who gives them any consideration at all.

It's Paul's willingness to play demagogue to an audience like that which
makes many of us who might otherwise support him a bit nervous.


#6 — June 20, 2007 @ 11:55AM — Paul

I think Dave is confused.

#7 — June 20, 2007 @ 12:06PM — Mythic Mystic

9-11 Commission Report, HA! Have you even read it? Wasn't that what Dr. Paul
was talking about when he mentioned 'blowback'? BTW - What does it say about
Bldg 7 or does that not matter because it is too hard to comprehend? The
whole Anti-'Tin-Foil-Hat' ideal is a safe place for those with bloodlust in
their harts, lack of vision in their minds, and cowardness in the face of
power. Now you can marginalize every thing as 'Oh, so you think Bush did
it', which would be incorrect anyway if you really researced ANYTHING. But
continue to allow America to believe in the New America instead of the
Constitution. Just because you love liberty and understand what it means
does not not mean you are a 'Conspiracy Nut'. Granted there are some way-out
things that people claim about 9-11 (pancake?) but there is also SOLID
research being done. No, the 9-11 Report was NOT an investigation. If it was
we would have seen truck loads of evidence being shipped to D.C. or the
Commish halting the steal from leaving New York to go to China.

BTW - about the Bush, he has more ties to OBL than Saddam ever had (can you
say Arbusto Oil?). And while your at it, since you know everything, check
out Grandpa Bush Prescott. Then you will know where Bush got his family

#8 — June 20, 2007 @ 12:53PM — G

Paul has flat out stated he believes al Qaeda was responsible for 9/11. I
don't know how much clearer he can get than that. The people he turns to for
his facts on the "War on Terror" are respected members of the intelligence
community and academia.

He is always skeptical of the government, of course, and so appeals to
conspiracy theorists who are also skeptical. I don't see a problem in that.

He's also hardly an extremist, or at least not one who wants to force his
views on others (other than probably wanting abortion outlawed by states,
but thats more of a "when does life begin?" issue than a religious one).

#9 — June 20, 2007 @ 13:08PM — Dave Nalle [HYPERLINK

9-11 Commission Report, HA! Have you even read it?

Not only have I read it, but I've also read the followup reports from the
NTSC and other investigating agencies debunking the various claims made
after the report was complete.

Wasn't that what Dr. Paul was talking about when he mentioned 'blowback'?

Probably. But 'blowback' is a very simple term for a much more complex idea.
It makes a great soundbyte, but it's almost meaningless in the context of
radical islam? Blowback for the Shah? 50 years later? Why not blowback for
the Siege of Jerusalem 900 years ago?

BTW - What does it say about Bldg 7 or does that not matter because it is
too hard to comprehend?

I've never said there are no questions about 9/11, but the grand
conspiracies just don't hold up.

But continue to allow America to believe in the New America instead of the

What is this 'new america'? I'm not familiar with it.

Just because you love liberty and understand what it means does not not mean
you are a 'Conspiracy Nut'.

True. Those who love liberty should oppose the truthers and other conspiracy
nuts, because they are one of the greatest threats to our constitutional


#10 — June 20, 2007 @ 13:12PM — dave is an idiot

Ron Paul has made it extremely clear that he thinks Al Qaeda is reponsible
for 9/11. So much so that he thinks we should have targeted the war against
OBL instead of Iraq. He doesn't skirt the issue. He is the most direct and
honest candidate out their when it comes to discussing 9/11 it's causes adn
the "war on terrorism" it is all the otehr candidates who "skirt" these

#11 — June 20, 2007 @ 13:43PM — Nick

The greatest threat to our Constitutional Republic are citizens that don't
vote for Constitutionalists, but rather vote for sound byte politicians that
try to explain what Americans thinkm, as if we were united in our thoughts
about anything. The only thing we should be united in, is our Constitutional
integrity. The flag, the military, the President...they are not
representative of freedom, or of rights. The Constitution is. If you would
start promoting politicians like Dr. Paul instead of accusing him of
pandering to conspiracy theorists (gee, I wonder why people might think a
conspiracy lurks) maybe we would have leaders that want us all to be free
and to live by our Constitution. He is not the enemy. The enemy is made up
of gun grabbers, dictators, signing statements, imperialists, warmongers,
entitlement promoters, and special interest politicians. Ron Paul fits none
of those categories. Research every other candidate and they fit at least
one, guaranteed.

#12 — June 20, 2007 @ 13:49PM — mean Gene

Republican presidential candidates Mitt Romney, Sam Brownback, Jim Gilmore,
Mike Huckabee, Tommy Thompson, and Tom Tancredo will participate in this
Iowa forum.
So......Ron Paul, Fred Thompson, Newt Gingrich, Rudy Giuliani, Duncan Hunter
and John McCain are not included.
I know Fred Thompson and Newt Gingrich haven't committed to running so no
biggie there.
But were Rudy, Duncan and John offered a place at the forum but chose to
Was only Paul snubbed?

#13 — June 20, 2007 @ 13:54PM — Jay

Independent switching to the GOP so I can vote for Ron Paul in the
Primaries. Dr. Ron Paul 2008!

#14 — June 20, 2007 @ 13:58PM — chad morehouse


if you think that the 911 commission was thorough then we must be talking
about different reports.

the author of this article was refering to the fact that it took congress
almost a year after 911 to commission a report and that was only because of
the victims families demanded it. then, few of the testimonies were taken
under oath, alot of the documentation was classified( and still is, think
pentagon video's) and was only allowed to be viewed by select people.

so asking questions, or even considering anouther investigation is not ( or
should not be) so proposterous.

especially since we know alot more now than we did when the report came out
( such as several of the hijackers have been reported as to still being
alive, noone was reprimanded for incopetence in norad or any other agency,
etc.) so i think asking questions is perfectly reasonable.

Ron Paul just wasn't to this debate because he is honest and knows more
about the given topics than anyone else running for office, if you call the
president of "Iowans for tax relief" and ask why they did not/will not
invite him, they will either hang up on you or ask you to leave a message,
never will they say why the taxpayers best friend is not welcome at a debate
sponsored by a non for profit tax relief organization.

#15 — June 20, 2007 @ 14:00PM — Mythic Mystic

Blowback is actually very complicated. Put in simple terms it can be
considered revenge of sorts. If you're saying that over 50 years of
'interventionalism' could not create a radical ideologies than why do they
attack us? Because of our freedoms? So let's take all those away so we can
be safe, right? (BTW-50 years is a short time in the span of humanity, ever
seen a Confederate Flag?)
Cultures in the middle east have not always been angry at the U.S. In fact,
many Islamic and Arab nations LOVED America because it was the FIRST
anti-colonial nation in the 'West'. For the past 100 years we have been in a
slide into the 'Old ways of government' all because we are 'scared' of
'those people'. Seems like Government sponsored racisim to me.
The 'New America' I speak of is this Neo-Con Juggernaught that has been
firmenting for years. Those in the current administration (originaly) were
refered to during the Regan years as 'The Crazies'. The PNAC (Project for
the New American Century) explains the need for America to become, how
should I say, more proactive by force in the world. This was published in
2000. I'm sure you have heard the soundbyte 'Everything has changed because
of 9-11'. Well what? We have always been the enemy of Tyrrany so that is a
given. But why must we throw out the Constitution and the Bill of Rights?
How does that make us safe? We will allow the 'Terrorists' to win if we
destroy our national foundations. Now you can not say that the Constitution
hasn't been abused off and on throughout our history, but the kind of
tactics used these days are very similar to those that we have opposed in
the past.
Now why are 'truthers' and 'conspiracy nuts' dangerous? Because they give a
justification for terror? What a propaganda tactic that is!! (just denounce
the dissenting veiw as unpatriotic and a danger to the nation) Just like the
ol'Nazi idea.
If you have a drug or alcohol problem what is the first thing you need to
do? ADMIT YOUR PROBLEM! That is what 'truthers' and 'conspiracy nuts' are
trying to do to help save this REPUBLIC (thanks for noting it is a Republic
an not a Democracy).
They are not 'blaming America first' they are willing to own up to what we
have done against even our OWN laws so we can move forward in this world and
reclaim our heritage. You must have questions, but are afraid of the answers
you may be given. What 'Grand Conspiracy' do you speak of? Is it the threat
of Globalism taking over the spirit of Nationalism? Or do you relate it more
to the UFO/Reptoid group of wakos. If it is the ladder, you are sorely
mistaken by what it means to be a 'Truther'. I don't see how asking
questions could be dangerous especialy when this is OUR nation, WE THE

#16 — June 20, 2007 @ 14:33PM — BabaRamDass

Bret, I didn't say that Paul believes in the 9/11 conspiracy, but that the
author of this article does. As I said, Paul panders to those people.

Wrong. Ron Paul panders to those people who value liberty.

#17 — June 20, 2007 @ 14:34PM — Michael H.


sandersresearch. com
globalresearch. ca
onlinejournal. com
larouchepub. com
danielestulin. com/?op=noticias&idioma=en
carolynbaker. org

If you like what you see, please spread the message.

Have a nice day :-)

#18 — June 20, 2007 @ 15:06PM — Lumpy [HYPERLINK

US interventionism didn't create radical islam. It just gives it something
to focus its attacks on.

As for the paul 'snub' the press release from his campaign says that they
were not overlooked,but rather deliberately excluded.

#19 — June 20, 2007 @ 16:05PM — mnjrupp

Lumpy, US interventionism didn't create radical islam, but it did create
I didn't create "fire-ants" but if I stick my bare-foot in the middle of the
ant bed, it IS my fault for getting stung!

Let's return back to our foundation.

#20 — June 20, 2007 @ 16:16PM — bbruhwiler8

You gotta be kidding me. The latest polls show that MOST Americans KNOW 911
was an inside job. If you haven't yet seen the overwhelming evidence, go to
YouTube or Google Video and watch --> 911 mysteries, 911 in plane site,
terror storm, loose change, zeitgeist the movie, money masters <-- Question
the official story.

#21 — June 20, 2007 @ 16:17PM — Lumpy [HYPERLINK

It occurs to me that conspiracy theories are nothing more than another way
to avoid having to take personal responsibility. If you can blame the
world's problems on shadowy super-powerful conspiracies then you never have
to account for your own weakness and failure. You're just another helpless

#22 — June 20, 2007 @ 16:23PM — Lumpy [HYPERLINK

Mnjrupp. 'blowback' is just empty jargon for people who want to state
something supidly obvious and sound trendy doing it.

You attack people it pisses them off. Duh. But what about all the millions
of moderate arabs who are glad someone will stand up to the terrorists or
the iranian intellectuals who still remind us that things have never been
better in iran tha they were under the shah. Is that all 'blowback' too?

#23 — June 20, 2007 @ 16:29PM — Henry

Ron Paul will win. I know what your thinking. Your thinking I'm crazy and
that Ron Paul has no chance. He may not win the election but the fire he is
lighting in people's minds and hearts will eventually be victorious. Whether
it be another bloody revolution in this country against an unconstitutional
government or that people wake up and clean out the White house and
congress. The message will win, therefor Ron Paul wins and the people win.
Doubt me now if you want, but you will be wrong.

#24 — June 20, 2007 @ 16:37PM — Davy C Rockett

The Republican Party has been hijacked by liberals also referred to as
"Neo-Cons", hardly conservative or fo small government.

Ron Paul is the only sensible and true conservative to come down the road in
a very long time.
America can't miss this chance to return to our Constitutional Rule of Law.

Yes it will take more than a Ron Paul in the WH, to start following
Constitution, but it would be a great start to getting people and authority
to wake up and understand the laws of our land.

#25 — June 20, 2007 @ 16:44PM — Davy C Rockett

Lumpy, if I walked up to you and punched you in the face, your telling me
that there would be no "blowback" towards me, from you.
I don't think so.

C'mon where's "founding father commonsense" these days.

Oh yeah I remember,... Ron Paul 2008.

Don't you think Iowans deserve to know he's running for President?

#26 — June 20, 2007 @ 17:11PM — allan Neal

I was going to comment, basically stating that love is more powerful than
hate and hate is war and bla bla bla, let's vote for Ron Paul. Then I saw
the note about personal attacks. I would think "pile of crap" would fall
under that. Thus, I can't take any of you seriously. Attack?

#27 — June 20, 2007 @ 17:23PM — Thomas

When the organizers snub Ron Paul, they might be representing their
organizations. Or they might have personal incentives. In either case,
action is mostly intramural.

Those within the organization who feel like they are not represented well
might want to seek Ron Paul information. Perhaps local Ron Paul supporters
will be able to help them out.

#28 — June 20, 2007 @ 18:11PM — goldenequity [HYPERLINK

Audio Just Posted:

Ron Paul's Campaign Chairman Kent Snyder
faces off with
Ed Failor Chairman of Iowa Tax Relief org.
WHO Newsradio Jan Mickelson's call-in.


#29 — June 20, 2007 @ 18:20PM — goldenequity [HYPERLINK

Who IS Ron Paul? Do your own homework.
NOBODY explains Ron Paul
BETTER than Ron Paul himself!

Here is an interactive audio archive of
Ron Paul speeches and interviews as a resource in chronological


Audio Just Posted:

Ron Paul's Campaign Chairman Kent Snyder
faces off with
Ed Failor Chairman of Iowa Tax Relief org.
WHO Newsradio Jan Mickelson's call-in.



#30 — June 20, 2007 @ 20:00PM — Jacob [HYPERLINK

"Christian extremist"

dave, what exactly is your definition of extremist? that's like calling
tiger woods a golfing extremist. ron paul would force his religion on others
no more than tiger woods forces his golfing on others.

#31 — June 20, 2007 @ 21:04PM — Dave Nalle [HYPERLINK

A christian extremist - to me anyway - is anyone who believes in the
Christian god and thinks that belief should in any way play a role in
setting national, state or local government policy. Ron Paul has supported
prayer in schools. Ergo he is a christian extremist. Maybe not the worst of
the lot, but it's something to consider.


#32 — June 20, 2007 @ 21:55PM — BuckinOhio [HYPERLINK

Stop the lieing about 911 questions being on the fringe. Nobody believes it

The latest nationally recognized polls show on 16% believe the so-called
official lie-story about 911.

#33 — June 20, 2007 @ 22:10PM — Clavos

BuckinOhio says:

"The latest nationally recognized polls show on 16% believe the so-called
official lie-story about 911."

Here's what Angus Reid (which he cites) really said:

"Only 16 per cent of respondents say the government headed by U.S. president
George W. Bush is telling the truth on what it knew prior to the terrorist
attacks, down five points since May 2002. (emphasis added)

For the record.

#34 — June 20, 2007 @ 23:03PM — Dave Nalle [HYPERLINK

Which is quite a bit different from what the Buckeye claimed it said. He
needs to read my brief explanation of how polls can be misrepresented over
on the other Ron Paul thread.

And BTW, in the latest LA Times/Bloomberg poll 63% of Americans believe
illegals should be given amnesty.

Oh, and 75% of Americans believe in angels.


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